Lawd

[alchemistdoctor]

TW: Fandom wank, darkfic, vague mention of nonconsensual vore

There are two types of people I loathe in fandom: the ones who read tagged warnings, disregard them, and then go on to leave wank all over stuff because "wawaaaah my mental health/bad things in fic/stuff I don't like exists", and the people who don't tag at all and then complain about people wanting tags/not interacting.

Especially on the Archive, but just in general.

Group A sit in their glass houses, throwing stones and then whining when their house gets broken -- you hurt me by writing this, I know you put up a big sign that said pointy writing don't touch without gloves but then I touched it without gloves and you are now personally responsible for the spines in my finger. Like wow. Unhealthy mental projection up the ass, and, in addition, so much entitlement. They've fucked over so many fandom spots: Tumblr's a big one, that finally caved to the pressure of "nothing that can hurt the infant babies, what if children see" despite under-13 being banned from the site in the terms of service. I'm a MorMor fan, okay, there is NOTHING healthy and good about two serial killers/criminals/general douchebags fucking around together, and of course I got these attacks on the reg.

On the other hand? Group B? Just as bad. These guys sit on their thrones of "long-term fandom" with an attitude of, "Get over it, if you don't have a thick skin yet, you're just too baby of a fan." Like those assholes who bulldoze waitstaff with the excuse of "I was a waiter, once they work here a while they'll get used to it." Uh. Or maybe we could just be kind?

I'm not saying stop writing darkfic, like no, uh. I've written it. But just fucking tag your things, people. "It's too much effort." You just wrote 50k words about Hannibal noncon literally eating Will, and you can't type "nonconsensual vore"? Two words??????? "I feel like less people read my fic when they know what's in it." Uh, yeah, you get more hits when there's no 'nonconsensual vore' tag, because some people don't like nonconsensual vore, got halfway through and noped out.

But let's say you're on the Archive, which is excellent because it forces you to do at least a few major warning tags, and gives you an out, that says Author Chose not to Use Archive Warnings. Great, you think, and you hit that. Awesome! Good job!

Then I fucking better never see you complain on any platform ever about decreased readership/engagement. Even obliquely, and yes I do mean those goddamn Twitter polls "I haven't seen much on my last fic, what do you think I should try next??" You chose not to warn, and people went, "Aha, this area has been unmarkéd on my Quest Map, I shall hereforwith give it a wide berth" and now you're whining.

Also, it turns out that tags have an actual primary use, that's secondary to all this nonsense: helping people sort things! And you're not helping! At all! The Archive is working really hard to keep records organised and you're just sitting there, happily whiting out the front cover so nobody knows where to shelve you. Ugh.

I see a lot of whining about Group A, then whining about Group B, and then fandom swings back to Group A every few years, like a pendulum of Dumb Shit, and I'm just.

Tag your shit, read the tags, don't like the tags, don't read the fic.

Don't shout "don't like don't read" and not tag. I didn't know I was about to read something I don't like or I wouldn't have read it, that's the point of tagging.

And lastly? If you sit there all "tags ruin my plot reveal"? Then you're just a bad writer, buddy, and bad at tagging. You don't have to tag "Tony Stark dies horribly." Just tag "major character death" and "gore", yadumbass.

Endrant.

Comments

[muccamukk]

*heartily co-signs all of this*

Though I've been hearing that in some fandoms, people search problematic tags and yell at people writing it, so the fic writers are not tagging to avoid them.

SO THAT'S FUN!

(Feels like ff.net's porn ban all over again.)

[alchemistdoctor]

That's Group A, being assholes again. *headdesk* They will not be satisfied until we have somehow eradicated ALL PROBLEMATIC THINGS EVER from the FACE OF THE EARTH. As the title says.... lawd.

Oh wow that was an early one. Did it go FF, LJ, then Tumblr, or was it LJ, FF, then Tumblr? I don't remember. I feel like I just shift when fandom gets wanky and then move on as we get banned. Like a a fed up pirate jumping from ship to ship.

[muccamukk]

I was late getting to LJ, but I think it was ff.net->LJ->tumblr/AO3, but there was a lot of overlap between them of course.

I just remember frantically saving porn the weeks before the ban came down on ff.net, and then realising that everyone had just changed their E rated fic to M, and it was all still there, now just not warned for porn.

Basic Rules:

[alchemistdoctor]

Same. So much copy paste. And those were the times of family computers, so I had to make hidden folders so my mum couldn't find it all.

I can just see her, finding it only to wondering why the hell her child was so into Tokyo Mew Mew. (Answer: cause my best friend was, duh.)

[smallhobbit]

I checked on some of my fics which are labelled 'authors chooses not to use archive warnings' and realised a number of them are Shakespeare, so dealing with canon character death, but this is only a side issue although technically 'major character death'. I tend to assume that anyone reading Shakespeare fics isn't going to be surprised at the outcome.

[alchemistdoctor]

I've seen stuff like that tagged as 'canon-typical violence' before, which seems to work.

I haven't got anything against the "author chooses not to use archive warnings" tag. It's honestly a great system and I feel like it does its job quite well. It's only when people decide to get all wanky about lack of readers/involvement that I get annoyed, because the "author chooses not to use archive warnings" will, by its nature, mean that some people avoid the fic.

[alexcat]

The thing that confuses me is what to tag sometimes. I mean it's an explicit rated fic with two people. If I don't do anything really weird, then I can't figure why i need to tag every variety of sex that people do... if it's a kink, yes, but normal vanilla-ish sweet sex... why do I need to tag vaginal intercourse? I see fics with 40 + tags and my eyes glaze over before I real them all. I'm old and we only warned about violence and kinks in the old days - maybe a little sparse in the tagging - but I've seen 'meat eating' tagged... and it meant non vegetarian eating... I mean, really!

I have had to warn that my fics were not friendly for Tony Stark/Pepper Potts shippers because I wrote Tony having a one night stand with Natasha Romanov. I tend to overtag relationships since then I guess.

[out_there]

I see fics with 40 + tags and my eyes glaze over before I read them all. I'm old and we only warned about violence and kinks in the old days

That's exactly where I'm at. I'm not against tagging, per se, but I don't honestly use tags to filter for works (unless I'm looking to read something specifically kinky). I don't read the tags when they're a paragraph long -- I just look at the overall pairing, rating, warning, and summary. Then again, I don't write anything especially dark or in a particularly dark fandom (Hannibal... well, that's a fandom that's bound to have some disturbing stories).

[alchemistdoctor]

Yeah, I am definitely more likely to read the tags in certain fandoms. But I also like kink when it’s healthy kink, which means that a badly tagged unhealthy kink fic can make me spiral when I get to an unexpected nonconsensual scene, for example. So I definitely rely on tags to follow “don’t like don’t read.”

[alchemistdoctor]

I find tags to be warnings for common triggers, tropes, and pairings. I do see people over tag, and I find that’s often because a reader requested it. Which is fine, but I don’t think one needs to tag “oral sex” in an E rated fic, for example.

But things like “bad BDSM practice” should be tagged, because just “BDSM” may be great for some people, while safewords being ignored can be extremely traumatic. So I think it really comes down to

A) does it put your fic into the correct category? Ship, fandom, rating. Basic Archive maintenance.
B) if someone has a common trigger (sexual assault, child abuse, violence) are they adequately warned?
C) if you don’t want to tag for B, don’t tag warnings at all. Use that “Author Chooses not to use Archive Warnings” option. It’s there as a catch-all and a general warning that a reader enters at their own risk.

Like I said: that tag has a good space.

The whole “You should warn that my favourite character isn’t portrayed nicely!” group is Group A and that’s not what tags are for. :/

[firecat]

I'm considering putting out my first non-gen fanfic, and this post is both helpful and kinda terrifying, lol.

[luredin]

This is all so well-put. 100% agree. I recently came across a fic that was tagged “Star Wars” (because the two characters watched the movies) but was not tagged with pi** drinking, and I’m just like...things like this make me want to require a Common Sense in Tagging course that everyone must take before posting to the Archive. I understand that sometimes people don’t think things all the way through and sometimes things slip through the cracks, but I don’t honestly understand train wrecks of tagging like the one I just mentioned. It always fascinates me—how was this decision reached?! People shouldn’t have to stumble blindly into a fic to discover its kinks. At a bare minimum you tag the kinks FIRST, and then, oh I don’t know, you can incidentally mention movie watching if you think it’s that important to your porny story. *eyeroll*